Author Topic: Do we really care about Brexit  (Read 127354 times)

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Offline Bob DeBilda

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #510 on: May 26, 2019, 13:04:08 PM »
She is a sugare dancer too.

Definitely a quality any future PM obviously needs  ::)
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Offline baldy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #511 on: May 26, 2019, 13:40:06 PM »
Baldy, you missed out her walk. That stop she has really bugs me :)


Me too, but I don't hold her stoop against her. It would have been no issue if she had actually been any good at her job.
« Last Edit: May 26, 2019, 13:44:56 PM by baldy »
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Offline baldy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #512 on: May 26, 2019, 13:42:04 PM »
The thing that concerned me about Amber was when she was Home Secretary she seemed to endorse all of May's cockups , and may no attempt to reverse them. Just felt a bit weak to me, unable to stand up to May.


But, she was obviously unable to cross Mrs May who would have sacked her. Clearly, she was put in the job as Home secretary to cover up for Mrs May and she had no choice about that.  Like I said, a few more years in high office will prepare her for a bigger role (if it happens).
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Offline baldy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #513 on: May 26, 2019, 13:44:05 PM »
She is a sugare dancer too.

Definitely a quality any future PM obviously needs  ::)


Truly awful, and really that example just proved that she was truly lacking in basic human skills in a way that no normal politician could be because she was given an easy Conservative seat in Maidenhead.  Maidenhead would have elected a donkey if it had a blue rosette on it. Oops, maybe they really did ...
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Offline DORIAN

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #514 on: May 27, 2019, 18:32:34 PM »
so Farage Has an election celebration, but, for what, if this waRolled out to a general election, would this mirror the Euro election. basically, all we have learned is that Clarity speaks wonders, and all the parties fudged the detail, so, we have a new leader of the Tory Party very soon, and what changes.... i am afraid very little, so, dont quote me,,,,,, i do not think we shall ever see an out deal even with Farage as a new Prime minister... JESUS. and of course i will be lambasted by others....but is this not the politics of the country is all about, everyone so polarised in their stance. hopefully there will never be an outcome and we stay put
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Offline Bob DeBilda

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #515 on: May 27, 2019, 22:58:26 PM »
If we make some assumptions regarding the outcome of the recent elections we see that the only party advocating Brexit, I.e The Brexit Party, actually polled less than all the other parties that fundamentally want to remain.
You also have to assume that everyone who wants to leave the EU voted for the Brexit party.
Based on that, more people now want to stay than leave!

And Dorian is correct, it changes nothing in Parliament. As does changing PM, even with one that can dance, not stoop and can talk with an Eton educated voice. FFS ::)
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Offline Michael

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #516 on: May 28, 2019, 07:29:11 AM »
If we make some assumptions regarding the outcome of the recent elections we see that the only party advocating Brexit, I.e The Brexit Party, actually polled less than all the other parties that fundamentally want to remain.
You also have to assume that everyone who wants to leave the EU voted for the Brexit party.
Based on that, more people now want to stay than leave!

And Dorian is correct, it changes nothing in Parliament. As does changing PM, even with one that can dance, not stoop and can talk with an Eton educated voice. FFS ::)
Not strictly true, the Tory vote would have contained leavers and remainers as would the Labour vote, and we should not forget UKIP, I do agree however that this latest vote for MEP places changes nothing, it simply reflects the original vote in the referendum and it does seem that opinions have not changed.
The Brexit Party seems a little confused in it's aims however, demanding a place on the negotiating team while stating that the UK leave the EU without a deal in October.
It is clear that a compromise will have to be found if we are to avoid the continueing split in British opinion which is proving to be very damaging, perhaps even more so than the damage predicted by remainers.


Offline baldy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #517 on: May 28, 2019, 08:08:22 AM »
Mike

I think Nigel has said several times he wants his group of MEPs to be included in the negotiating team that meets with Brussels-based EU officials to discuss a new deal.

Some of the candidates for the Tory leadership have mentioned ditching the existing botched, unpopular deal and renegotiating for a Canada ++ style (free trade) deal which is what the EU originally offered us but the Maybot rejected it because she wanted something that felt more of a compromise.

I suspect that the Tories will go for a Canada ++style  free trade deal because the EU is likely to co-operate and it could be done relatively quickly ... and, the Tories will tell Nigel to stay out of it ...
« Last Edit: May 28, 2019, 10:54:09 AM by baldy »
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Offline Shizzy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #518 on: May 28, 2019, 08:58:05 AM »
Big assumptions there Bob :). I assume you have taken in the nationalist parties in your calculations. I think for them the biggest driver for voters is their nationalist agenda and not their stance on Brexit, pretty much the same with the greens.

What I take from these results is.

1. Both Cons and Labour are being punished for their middle of the road stance.  Parties which have a strong stance either way have attracted votes.

2. The country is still divided equally as to remain and leave.

Where this leaves the main parties I have no idea. By taking a definite stance either way you straight away alienate half your base. This is why JC has been sitting on the fence. His traditional base want Brexit (so does he), but his new leftie friends in London want to remain. At some point he will need to decided which group to sacrifice.
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Offline Shizzy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #519 on: May 29, 2019, 09:43:57 AM »
oh dear Alistair Campbell has been a naughty boy.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48434842
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Offline Michael

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Offline Shizzy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #521 on: May 29, 2019, 12:57:48 PM »
Anyone can crowd fund and launch a court action. Wait and see what the result is.
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Offline Bob DeBilda

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #522 on: May 29, 2019, 18:54:34 PM »
We don’t need a court to tell us BoJo the clown is a lying Barsteward.
 Him, Gove, Fromage et al = lying bastar*s

Their lies persuaded enough gullible people to vote leave and for us to end up in the sugare.
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Offline Shizzy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #523 on: May 30, 2019, 08:20:57 AM »
All politicians lie. This action is obviously politically motivated by a remainer who can't accept the result. Why not prosecute JC for lying about supporting the result of the referendum, or Nick Clegg for saying he wouldn't introduce tuition fees?
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Offline baldy

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Re: Do we really care about Brexit
« Reply #524 on: May 30, 2019, 09:04:22 AM »
Well, I would prefer BOJO to defend the action on the basis that the claim or statement was essentially true or was based on some sort of relevant fact. It seems he is concentrating at this stage on the legal procedures first so he is trying to get the case dismissed as not one that should go to court anyway.

I noticed that one point in the charge is that he was in a public office at the time - ie. Mayor of London.  I find this odd as he was in fact acting in a political campaign which had nothing to do with this office.

As a councillor (previously town and district and currently a unitary councillor), I've tangled with the exact same code of conduct systems which also apply to Mayors. I well remember BOJOs predecessor, Ken Livingstone, being suspended by the Adjudication Panel for England (which became part of the first tier of tribunals before it was dismantled in 2012) after hearing complaints that he had been antisemitic in public. Ken took his appeal to the High Court which immediately suspended his suspension and later decided that Ken was not actually on duty as Mayor when he abused a Jewish reporter.

This legal point of a public servant only being on duty when actually at work or at other events when undertaking his/her duties or writing stuff in their public role etc, means that an accusation of a breach of their responsibility to abide by a code of conduct does not apply when off duty or actually doing something else. The APE tribunal decision was overturned and the case was thrown out on the basis that Ken was not on duty as Mayor.

In particular, it is a well established point that the code of conduct does not apply when campaigning for political elections. The issue here I think is that BOJO was not a candidate himself. He was leading a political campaign as a national political figure ... which I expect he will argue did not mean he was actually acting as London Mayor but as BOJO, the national figure who also has been MP, Mayor, TV character, journalist, author etc etc ...

I fully expect this case to be dismissed on the basis that BOJO was not acting in his official public role (Mayor of London) at the time of leading the Leave campaign.

A lot will depend on whether he signed anything with the claims on as Mayor or used his Mayoral official notepaper.  It will not be sufficient that people simply say he was Mayor at the time. They need to show he was specifically acting in his role as Mayor and not mistakenly calling himself Mayor when he was not doing Mayor-type work etc ...
« Last Edit: May 30, 2019, 09:14:17 AM by baldy »
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